The Glade 4.0

If the food and water comes with a bible, then the purpose of giving is clouded by an ulterior motive of conversion and proslytization. I have personal issues with that. Those issues do *not* in any way stand in the way of me thinking the money, food, and supplies should go there anyway.

The key point you are ignoring is that organizations like Robertson's don't just offer god as some sort of consolation. They generally exploit the natural resources of these areas for the personal profits of people like Pat Robertson, and they also make sure that their aid comes with strings attached.

It's like the Roman Catholic Charities that threatened to pull out of DC entirely if they passed marriage equality. "We'll serve your poor and needy so long as you do as we say". It makes the charity ring false to me.

No, that doesn't mean we should stop that aid. I do think we need to scrutinize it, however, given Robertson's penchant for exploiting places like this.

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It feels like all the people who want limited government really just want government limited to Republicans.
---The Daily Show

I keep reading this thread as "Christian Bale blames Haitians for disaster." Which is bizarre.

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Well Ali Baba had them forty thieves, Scheherezade had a thousand tales
But master you in luck 'cause up your sleeves you got a brand of magic never fails...
...Mister Aladdin, sir, What will your pleasure be?
Let me take your order, Jot it down -You ain't never had a friend like me
█ ♣ █

You're not the only one.

If the food and water comes with a Bible, then like almost everything in life, it comes with a price. I imagine the Haitian people are familiar with missionaries, and like the folks showing up at the Salvation Army Missions, they can take the sermon and get some food, some drink, and some sleep, or they can protest the religious and take their chances without the food and drink.

From the religious viewpoint, where better to perform the Almighty's work than among those in shock, in despair or on the edge of it. Who needs the word of God in their life right now more? Again, from a religious person's viewpoint, not yours.

Once again you have mixed up the concepts of charity and hand-outs Monte. Nothing requires the Christian, or missionaries of any religion, to refrain from trying to attend to a person's soul while attending to their mortal needs. Your passionate hatred for Christian missionary work biases every comment you make on the subject.

Would you protest as loudly if a worker with the Red Crescent were talking to those seeking relief in a disaster, and talking about Allah and the Koran?

It happens every time the Red Crescent helps out. Are they being evil Islamics as they pass out food, water, and the love of Allah?

Are you aware that the Red Cross and Red Crescent are joined in a federation - and have been for over 90 years?

Separation of church and state is one thing. You seem to want to eliminate church entirely. What would you put in its place?

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The U. S. Constitution doesn't guarantee happiness, only the pursuit of it. You have to catch up with it yourself. B. Franklin

"A mind needs books like a sword needs a whetstone." -- Tyrion Lannister, A Game of Thrones

The 6.1 aftershock is clearly a direct result of the Haitians not immediately converting en masse to Pat Robertson's ministry.

Micheal - there is a difference between attending to a person's soul, and using charity as a means to convert or coerce. We've turned the corner from simply offering comfort of a spiritual nature to using the charity offered by institutions of a religious nature as a bargaining chip for legislation and political influence.

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It feels like all the people who want limited government really just want government limited to Republicans.
---The Daily Show

I just wanted to point out Monte, so perhaps you understand some of the points made from a perspective you support, that this exact terminology could be applied to our political system of party, and from my perspective, directly to the strategies employed by the Democrats.

Well come on, we all know thats true anyway.

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The Dude abides.

The only problem with what you just said is that Christians would still render aid even if those they minister to choose not to follow Jesus. And I fail to see how any religious organization is using the Haiti disaster as a means for political advantage.

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The Dude abides.

Touching on what Screeling said, the only argument you can fabricate with this is if the Christian aid in Haiti is coming at the price of "we'll give you this food and water, but only if you swear allegiance to our God." There has been no indication whatsoever that this is happening.

Handing out a Bible with food and water does not forced coercion make.

Ok, so you have a personal issue with it. Why is that a matter for discussion.



Why do you care how they represent a God that you don't believe in anyhow, and what are these "strings"? How is Robertson going to personally profit in Haiti? You're just making vague allegations.



Who cares if it rings false to you? Who are you to say that churches should continue doing charity work when doing so would compromise the beliefs that make them a church in the first place?



Why should it be scrutinized any more than any other aid? Just because of your personal issues? Because of your unsubstantiated allegations of "exploitation"? Is Robertson prohibited from engaing in foriegn buisness ventures simply because he's a clergyman? Is this according to some law, or just you?

If you're claiming we should scrutinize him for illegal behavior for no other reason than that A) he espouses religious views you don't like and B) he supposedly "exploits" people in ways that, to my knowledge, he has never been criminally liable for, you need to refresh yourself on how the legal system works. We don't investigate or scrutinize people because of their beliefs.

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"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."

Even if he did precisely that, so what? He's an ***? Ok, we got it, he's an ***. He's not representing the government. He can "coerce" as many people as he wants by withholding his aid.

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"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."

Yes, he can, and doing such would make him an incredible ******* (not that he isn't already). But that would be a viable point of criticism, unlike what he's doing now.

Indeed. Like I said, he'd be an *** (even more than now). But even then, so what?

The original point of this thread is that he's an "icon". As I pointed out at the time, the point is to extend Robertson's assholeanism to anyone that pays attention to him, which is in turn vaguely represented as some undefined, but large, mass of evangelicals, and therefore to impeach evangelicals in general as awful people who try to convert others to their religion. It's further exacerbated by the simple representation of handing out Bibles (if even that is happening) as some sort of coercion or "string attached".

The real point isn't to cricticize Robertson, it's to cricticize evangelicals and Chrsitians in general through guilt by association, and even there, the cricticism is based entirely on Monty's personal issues with it.

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"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."

Monty, you don't know anything about whether or not his God, or any other exists. Please try to be a little more tolerant of people and a little less prejudiced about people that are different from you.

If i had money... I'd totally go and preach about the pink unicorn in Talya's closet, just to watch people's reactions...

I don't think the destruction of an entire country is really the appropriate time to preach about Taly's collection of battery operated adult novelties.

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Buckle your pants or they might fall down.

So it does exsist!

In other news, they have stopped the adoption of Haitian kids for fear of trafficing and other unlawful acts amid a sudden influx of adoption requests and the red cross' fast tracking of submissions.

As long as you pass out some food and water with it, what's the problem?

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"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."

Preferably popcorn and cokes. Maybe some raisinets too.

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Holy shitsnacks!

/tonguecheek

God damn that racist Christian Bale. How is it the haitians fault?

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Darksiege
Traveller, Calé, Whisperer
Lead me not into temptation; for I know a shortcut

[youtube]YTihsJQHt48[/youtube]

NSFW Language.

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Holy shitsnacks!